At 17:31:09 on 07.10.09, Flicka wrote:

Let's all write our arguments here on why we should keep hunting. As far as I'm concerned we are just following hounds and hounds are doing what comes naturally to them. It is the law of nature that foxes should have a predator. In the past it would have been wolves. We don't want to annihilate foxes but help keep the balance. Unfortunately where too many foxes are shot you end up with too many rabbits!! And the gun is no judge of the age or health of a fox. When hunting with hounds the fittest survive.

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At 20:22:19 on 07.10.09, NMH wrote:
Hunting respects a closed season for foxes to breed; other control free-for-all types don't. Hunting actually works on habitats to make sure there are good places for foxes to live & breed, benefitting other wildlife too; in hunting the fox gets away scot-free or dies immediately the lead hound catches up, no possibility of a lingering death as with shooting/traps/poison.

At 08:29:44 on 08.10.09, Flicka wrote:
Yes people get the idea that they are ripped to pieces before they have died when in fact the kill is actually very quick. Shooting on the other hand doesn't always kill a fox outright. A couple of seasons ago a farmer asked us to look out for some 'poor bugger' that had been shot at and had been dragging himself about for weeks so that we could put it out of its misery.

At 08:55:41 on 08.10.09, Sambo wrote:
Yes this is all spot on. When I was a kid on my uncles farm (a dairy farmer in devon mainly cows but also sheep)his farm dogs shot out of the landy after a fox. Now his livlihood depends on his animals so naturally he wasnt a big fan of foxes. His dogs cornered the fox and grabbed it then he got hold of it and killed it with a piece of rope as he had no gun so it was quite a long painful death I guess. I dont have a problem with it as I see foxes as vermin however thats how farmers tend to deal with pests, welfare is quite low down on their list of priortys and with hunts not being given the right to hunt legally a lot of foxes will suffer more than if they are killed by hounds which is quite a quick process and like you say its the older or sicker ones that get caught normally so its keeping the fox population healthy in my opinion. Oh and its great fun too. Its only down to hunters being stubborn that they've kept it going trail hunting (and when not being monitored the other type of trail hunting ahem) which sticks 2 fingers up at this rubbish government. Sorry rant over grrrrrr

At 15:34:39 on 10.10.09, NMH wrote:
Also, hunts have a vested interest in keeping a decent population of foxes - while farmers, without hunting, would sooner see them exterminated, or as nearly as they can, cos as Sambo says, foxes are vermin to them. So, if you like foxes, you should support hunting, it's in the fox's interest!

At 15:35:49 on 10.10.09, NMH wrote:
This was a very good idea Flicka; just one problem, we're preaching to the converted here!! But good for us to hone our arguments

At 21:31:21 on 10.10.09, Sambo wrote:
Hmmm yes good point but we need to have an answer for every question when challenged. Tell me a question you feel difficult to answer. Digging out is always a stumbler for me

At 08:54:05 on 12.10.09, Flicka wrote:
Yes that was my idea because sometimes with a good argument you can at least put someone 'on the fence' even if you don't completely win them over. NMH that's a really good point to get across that more foxes are killed over farmland where we don't hunt. Unfortunately where there is pheasant shooting you'll never find a single fox. As for digging out, I don't like that anyway.